Topic RSS8:42 pm
Site Contributor
Site Contributor
February 12, 2013
OfflineSquareEnix’s President stepped down today. This is partly to do with disappointing sales expectations for 3 of their big titles; Sleeping Dogs, Hitman Absolution and Tomb Raider (remember when Square and Enix made RPGs?).
Apparently, expected sales of 3.6 and 3.4 million for Hitman and Tomb Raider respectively, are weak.
In any other generation, those kinds of sales numbers would be considered a runaway success.
As we head into the PS4 / Xbox 720 era, will games be able to sell well enough to justify their increasingly large budgets?
Now playing: SNES - Phalanx, R-Type III, Genesis - Bio Hazard Battle, PS3 - Dragon's Crown
11:36 pm
Site Contributor
Site Contributor
March 14, 2012
OfflineTo deal with the story, I think that there is more going on than the story says.
Let me get this straight; Tomb Raider, which has sold 3.4 MILLION COPIES IN TWO WEEKS and still has momentum is a failure that is sinking the company? I’m going to go ahead and call bullshit on that. I don’t know how much the budget read for Tomb Raider, but I am fairly certain that it didn’t even cost a fraction of what Square’s in-house games cost to make.
Anybody remember this piece of shit?
Final fantasy 13 has sold around 6.5 million copies in THREE YEARS (guess how many it sold in it’s first month lol..Hint: Less than Tomb Raider did!) and took six years and the creation of a brand new engine.
Remember this debacle? Still doesn’t sell, still generates zero in direct revenue (It’s F2P), still a black hole that is sucking Square dry as they try to fix it.
How about this one? Versus 13 is STILL not out after 6 years in development (that means that the team is drawing a paycheck and resources are being utilized). With the announcement of two out of three of the next-gen systems I am beginning to doubt we will see it in the 7th generation. thus it has been a money pit.
How do you destroy dragon quest?!? Apparently the answer to that question is to boot Hori, go MMO, and charge a monthly fee to play it IN JAPAN. The natural result? Dragon quest 10 has sold less than 1 million copies in DQ-crazy japan. One wonders how high the drop-off rate is.

Square has destroyed this franchise by failing to understand that it is important to release games on consoles that still have momentum.
Where is this game? Square is destroying this franchise by failing to realize that people buy sequels at a higher rate than endless and derivative Gaiden Games.
Where is this game? Square has destroyed this franchise by expecting fans to approach remakes of a 15+ year-old game with the same zeal as a sequel.
Square needs to understand that western developers who release games that sell 3.4 million copies IN TWO WEEKS are not the problem. Square’s betrayal of their fans year after year and franchise-by-franchise is the problem. I am only sorry for Crystal D, who had the misfortune of pulling their heads out of their asses to late to avoid being sold to Squeenix. Too bad, since they finally seemed to be getting the message on what we want from a Tomb Raider game….
The story should be called Square Sacks Wata, Blames The Round-Eyes. WHAT A SNOW-JOB
————————————————————————————————————
….And to answer your initial question. Yes. Games cost way too much to make for much too small an audience. Furthermore, there are way too many games being created in comparison to how many customers buy. (average customer buys 4 games; Average developer puts out 13)
Exploring the New World on Nintendo Switch. Currently Playing: Zelda BOTW, Octopath Traveler, Sonic Mania, Yoku's Island Express, Mega Man 11. Currently Watching: Marble Hornets, Luther, Black Mirror, JoJo's Bizarre Adventure Part 5. Currently Reading: Influence by Robert Cialdini.
12:06 am
Site Contributor
Site Contributor
February 12, 2013
OfflineMong, I believe those were projected sales of the titles for their fiscal year, not actual sales to date (the article wasn’t too clear on that).
Still, you’re on the money about Square Enix having lost their way. Interestingly enough, they really started to go down hill after the merger (though Square needed to merge after wasting so much money on their terrible FF movie).
Now playing: SNES - Phalanx, R-Type III, Genesis - Bio Hazard Battle, PS3 - Dragon's Crown
12:32 am
Site Contributor
Site Contributor
March 14, 2012
OfflineFiscal Year for them ends in March : ) March 31st.
In regards to where the decline began, it always starts when things are still good.
You can begin to see what Square would become just by looking at the SNES games. I think that Square was always like this, but the technology limitations saved them from themselves. Look at Dissidia and the FF4 sequel to get a good look at what Square games WOULD have been like if they had the capability. The sad truth is it’s pretty much the SAME FUCKING PEOPLE that did Chrono Trigger and 6.
Exploring the New World on Nintendo Switch. Currently Playing: Zelda BOTW, Octopath Traveler, Sonic Mania, Yoku's Island Express, Mega Man 11. Currently Watching: Marble Hornets, Luther, Black Mirror, JoJo's Bizarre Adventure Part 5. Currently Reading: Influence by Robert Cialdini.
2:00 am
Site Contributor
Site Contributor
February 12, 2013
OfflineFeels like Square Enix was hoping their Western developed games would be a huge cash cow that they could use to finance whatever crazy project they felt like doing.
I honestly don’t see too many missteps by Squaresoft when I look back on their SNES days. Sure, the FF games lay on the melodrama a little thick, but they’re all quite solid.
Mario RPG was just brilliant and I am surprised they didn’t use that playstyle for another RPG in the Playstation era.
I would point to Final Fantasy VIII as the beginning of the end personally (at least for the FF series).
What’s really sad to me is that they’re sitting on a potential gold mine in the form of an FF7 remake, something fans have been pleading for for years. They’re also well aware of the demand for this. Instead, they’d rather make multiple spin-offs of FFXIII and iPhone games with tons of DLC / Premium content.
I wonder how much longer they can continue down this current path. Looks like they’re still sitting on a decent sized cash pile.
Now playing: SNES - Phalanx, R-Type III, Genesis - Bio Hazard Battle, PS3 - Dragon's Crown
2:38 am
Site Contributor
Site Contributor
March 14, 2012
OfflineI think that reasoning is accurate and would add that they probably intend to use the western studios as scapegoats so the blame doesn’t get heaped on the in-house games.
What I mean by looking at the SNES era for SINGS (not really decline, they were still solid) is the Arrogance. Giving the west (who invented Ultima) FF4 EasyType and FF Mystic Quest reeked of the arrogance that they are now known for.
Arrogance in storytelling. Like most other game companies Square never REALLY excelled at telling a story. The stories were never good, just passable due to the fact that we projected our own images onto the characters. We couldn’t experience what Square wanted us to see because they didn’t have the cutscenes and voiced dialogue in order to show their “vision”. Take a Squenix story to the library for a reading if you want a good laugh.
It also helped that these early Final Fantasy were designed first and foremost as a GAME. But again I could point to FF6 (which is my favorite) and the Opera Scene that Gamers rave about and say “See? What did that add? That was completely pointless. The Song didn’t even have shit to do with the story! Why is this here?”
In retrospect the opera Scene really set the stage for Square’s coming out party on the PS.
———————————————————————————————————————–
Earlier you brought up budgets. I say that there is no better example for the LIMITATIONS of High-Definition Graphics than FF13. With HD graphics it is just too expensive to do something like remake FF7. I really think that they would love to, but no way that game in HD makes it’s money back without being forced into the same TUBE as 13.
We also must ask the question of “Really? Do we REALLY want modern Square to Fuck up FF7 like they have everything else?”
Exploring the New World on Nintendo Switch. Currently Playing: Zelda BOTW, Octopath Traveler, Sonic Mania, Yoku's Island Express, Mega Man 11. Currently Watching: Marble Hornets, Luther, Black Mirror, JoJo's Bizarre Adventure Part 5. Currently Reading: Influence by Robert Cialdini.
9:17 am
Site Contributor
Site Contributor
February 12, 2013
OfflineIn Square’s defense re: FF MQ and easy FF4, RPGs weren’t selling well in the West (especially relative to Japan) despite the huge and growing game market. As well, I knew several people who used to scoff at RPGs or just wouldn’t give them a chance. They had to try SOMETHING.
So I get where they were coming from. By dumbing everything down they were trying to simplify the mechanics to make it easier for Western gamers to get into a style of game that they actually weren’t familiar with. Still, Mystic Quest isn’t a game that would convert a non-believer. As we all know, by dumbing the experience down, the game ended up feeling hollow. There’s no reason they had to skimp on the story so much.
Secret of Mana or another action-RPG was probably a better bet, giving gamers the action they’re used to while introducing the story, inventory management, etc. elements of the RPG genre.
There definitely was some arrogance on their part though, as I doubt they consulted with many (or any) Americans or European market experts in the game’s development.
Re: An FF7 remake, SquareEnix has gone on record saying they won’t do it until they make a game that surpasses that game’s experience. Reading between the lines, they’re saying we want to make the games we want, not give you the remake you’re clamouring for.
I have zero experience managing the development of an HD game (or any game), but I would imagine that an FF7 remake, if competently managed, would have as good a shot as any HD game at turning a profit (especially a JRPG).
You do have a point though; given SquareEnix’s recent track record, a remake could definitely turn into a “be careful what you wished for” situation.
Now playing: SNES - Phalanx, R-Type III, Genesis - Bio Hazard Battle, PS3 - Dragon's Crown
9:26 am
Site Veteran
Members
May 23, 2012
Offline2:55 pm
Site Contributor
Site Contributor
February 12, 2013
OfflineIt’s mind boggling how SquareEnix could go from being one of THE hottest publishers to basically being a joke in such a short period of time.
To an extent, what’s happening at SquareEnix is happening throughout all Japanese developers / publishers to varying degrees. Japan is sadly becoming less and less relevant to the future of gaming with each passing year.
Now playing: SNES - Phalanx, R-Type III, Genesis - Bio Hazard Battle, PS3 - Dragon's Crown
I think we will soon be looking at the rise of small indie developers taking over as the dominant source for games. Unfortunately that may also mean downloading games as the primary source for buying games as well.
Say goodbye to manuals, boxes and posters; things that made the video game buying experience all the more worthwhile. This is one of the reasons why some gamers are re-visting the older generation systems. You really couldn’t beat the quality of those NES manuals. They really enhanced the entire experience.
Resident Evil 6 doesn’t come with a manual. You can download it though.
6:55 pm
Site Contributor
Site Contributor
March 14, 2012
Offline@RushDawg; I personally don’t want this poor excuse for a company to Touch ANYTHING like Chrono Trigger or 6.(7 to the people who experienced and loved it. At this time I was on my way out of the hobby for a decade) though I definitely can see your point on Square Doing what THEY want to do rather than what the CUSTOMER wants. If there is any way that it is feasable then they should be doing it with the demand that exists.
What I mean by “now way it makes it’s money back” has less to do with possible mismanagement (they almost certainly would) and more to do with the fact that HD development is so fucking expensive that i don’t believe that they could even do it.
FF7 for being a straightforward adventure is pretty open, especially once you get the Airship enabling you to go revisit places you enjoy. In order to render Midgar, nibelheim, ect in 3D HD graphics FROM EVERY ANGLE means that the game must either A)cut out some of the open-ness to save on cost or B)cost way too much to make.
This is why FF13 took six years and looks plays like you are in a tube. You don’t have to show the world from every angle in HD if you are in a tube. I think a re-made FF 7 would resemble FF13, with a straight path that refuses to let you deviate and is there more to let you experience their “brilliant” story.
No thanks! If I ever get around to FF7 I will play it as intended.
——————————————————————————–
@Masamune;
So many gamers are now leaving modern consoles that analysts now have their own name for retro gaming: They call it the 4th Console. The 4th Console is a blanket term for the dollars robbed from the gaming industry by people buying retro.
How long have each of you been playing on the 4th console? And why are you here? What makes you play SMW and All-stars over NSMB Wii? Why do you play ALTTP instead of Skyward Sword? Chrono Trigger and FF 6 instead of FF 13?
Is it just nostalgia? or have the modern iterations of these franchises failed you as a customer and a gamer?
Exploring the New World on Nintendo Switch. Currently Playing: Zelda BOTW, Octopath Traveler, Sonic Mania, Yoku's Island Express, Mega Man 11. Currently Watching: Marble Hornets, Luther, Black Mirror, JoJo's Bizarre Adventure Part 5. Currently Reading: Influence by Robert Cialdini.
7:15 pm
Site Contributor
Site Contributor
February 12, 2013
OfflineMong, an FF7 remake could stick to pre-rendered backgrounds and still look fantastic. Take a look at the Gamecube’s Resident Evil remake (which has aged wonderfully) as proof of this.
As for the overworld, gamers were always willing to tolerate a lower level of detail here (the FF7 overworld looked bad even for its time), so I see this as a non-issue.
If the remake focused on beefing up the character models, drawing high-res pre-rendered backgrounds and improving the battle graphics, I think it would be feasible (assuming competent management).
Now playing: SNES - Phalanx, R-Type III, Genesis - Bio Hazard Battle, PS3 - Dragon's Crown
7:30 pm
Site Contributor
Site Contributor
March 14, 2012
OfflineI’ll have to look into this, as I have a BC Wii.
As long as they could avoid HDrendering everything like they did with 13 it sounds feasible. If so then it is exactly as you say; That Square would rather indulge their creativity then give gamers what they want.
BTW, how is FF7?
Exploring the New World on Nintendo Switch. Currently Playing: Zelda BOTW, Octopath Traveler, Sonic Mania, Yoku's Island Express, Mega Man 11. Currently Watching: Marble Hornets, Luther, Black Mirror, JoJo's Bizarre Adventure Part 5. Currently Reading: Influence by Robert Cialdini.
7:31 pm
Site Contributor
Site Contributor
February 12, 2013
OfflineMong: You said your gf is playing through Ni No Kuni; does that game have an overworld?
From what I’ve read about it, it appears to be a beautiful looking HD JRPG, which begs the question; why can’t SquareEnix make one?
Now playing: SNES - Phalanx, R-Type III, Genesis - Bio Hazard Battle, PS3 - Dragon's Crown
7:53 pm
Site Contributor
Site Contributor
March 14, 2012
OfflineFrom what I gather,It uses a cartoon style that does not present multiple angles that must be rendered. And yes, it has an overworld.
Square’s problem is that they attempt to achieve photorealism which limits gameplay and exploration opportunities.
It is just too expensive…
She loves it, BTW. Here’s hoping that I love it just as much.
Exploring the New World on Nintendo Switch. Currently Playing: Zelda BOTW, Octopath Traveler, Sonic Mania, Yoku's Island Express, Mega Man 11. Currently Watching: Marble Hornets, Luther, Black Mirror, JoJo's Bizarre Adventure Part 5. Currently Reading: Influence by Robert Cialdini.
8:07 pm
Site Contributor
Site Contributor
February 12, 2013
OfflineFF7 plays a lot like a classic FF game and has some great moments. Once you get out of Midgar, the world opens up and it feels a lot like FF4 or FF6 in how you complete the game from there. The plot is more confusing then the SNES games, but still relatively simple. Overall, its a fun, solid entry in to the series. Not quite as good as 6, but just as good, if not a little better, then 4.
On the downside, all of the characters feel more or less the same in battle due to the materia system. Everything from magic, to abilities like “jump” and “steal” are linked to materia, so you can make any character you want act as the healer, thief, etc. I’m more of a fan of the FF4/FF6/FF9 style where each characters have their own abilities. The pre-rendered backgrounds can also be challenging to navigate and fans are asking for a remake for a reason; the game looks ugly by today’s standards.
By the way, my first FF game was the original on the NES, where I had a hard time at first, because I didn’t know you had to equip weapons and armour (also I didn’t pick a white mage on my first attempt). From there, I played all the FF games on the SNES and absolutely loved 6. Even Mystic Quest had its moments.
Just thought I’d give you some background on my experience with the series, to give you some perspective on my thoughts on FF7. Most people who tout FF7 as the best game ever hadn’t played an RPG before it.
Now playing: SNES - Phalanx, R-Type III, Genesis - Bio Hazard Battle, PS3 - Dragon's Crown
8:11 pm
Site Contributor
Site Contributor
February 12, 2013
OfflineShould also mention that the game plays kind of slow. Some of the backgrounds take a while to run through and there’s a bit of a delay in transitioning to the battle screen.
Two of my all-time favourite RPGs, Chrono Trigger and Phantasy Star IV, really stand out to me because they respect the player’s time. Both games move along at a brisk pace and are much better for it.
Thinking back on PSIV specifically, it had an amazing feature where you could “talk” to your party and they’d tell you where you were supposed to go and what you were supposed to be doing. It was a great feature for people who hadn’t played the game in a couple weeks and had forgotten what they were supposed to be doing (probably the number one reason folks don’t finish RPGs). Strange that no game copied this feature.
Now playing: SNES - Phalanx, R-Type III, Genesis - Bio Hazard Battle, PS3 - Dragon's Crown
8:13 pm
Site Contributor
Site Contributor
March 14, 2012
OfflineThanks. It doesn’t sound like it makes 6 obsolete, so I’m not going to break my neck to play it. Is the Materia system kind of like a Jobs system from 5 that you wear? Cause that’s what it sounds like.
I cannot WAIT to begin doing FF 4 and 5. Six is still just as good as I remember.
Exploring the New World on Nintendo Switch. Currently Playing: Zelda BOTW, Octopath Traveler, Sonic Mania, Yoku's Island Express, Mega Man 11. Currently Watching: Marble Hornets, Luther, Black Mirror, JoJo's Bizarre Adventure Part 5. Currently Reading: Influence by Robert Cialdini.
8:26 pm
Site Contributor
Site Contributor
February 12, 2013
OfflineThe materia system is very similar to the jobs system, though it is a bit more open.
Basically, weapons and armour have materia slots available in them. In each slot, you can equip materia, which levels up as you fight and unlocks new abilities.
There are passive materia (e.g. Max HP +50%), magic materia (cure, fire, etc.), summon materia and ability materia (throw, steal, etc.)
You can equip “throw” and a “summon” materia at the same time for example, effectively making a character a ninja-summoner.
That said, the materia does NOTHING to change a characters appearance, so the characters all feel very malleable.
FF7 in no way makes FF6 obsolete, but that doesn’t mean its not worth playing through. Super Mario World doesn’t make Super Mario 3 obsolete, but that doesn’t mean one should skip it.
That said, I’d put FF7 lower then every other game I’ve recommended to you so far (SSF4, Valkyria Chronicles, Sonic Generations) by a pretty wide margin. Its visuals have not aged gracefully.
If you’re looking for a PS1 RPG, I’d recommend trying the Lunar games well before tackling FF7. Final Fantasy Tactics is a lot of fun though (it’s got the job system) and still looks good today.
Now playing: SNES - Phalanx, R-Type III, Genesis - Bio Hazard Battle, PS3 - Dragon's Crown
8:51 pm
Site Contributor
Site Contributor
March 14, 2012
OfflineI have VC, just waiting for the GF to give me back my PS3 lol!
Exploring the New World on Nintendo Switch. Currently Playing: Zelda BOTW, Octopath Traveler, Sonic Mania, Yoku's Island Express, Mega Man 11. Currently Watching: Marble Hornets, Luther, Black Mirror, JoJo's Bizarre Adventure Part 5. Currently Reading: Influence by Robert Cialdini.
1 Guest(s)
Log In
Register
Home

