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Violent Video Game Tax May Become Law In 2014 In Many States
January 2, 2014
11:10 am
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Mongunzoo
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Back in May of last year, vice President Joe Biden created quite a meltdown on Gaming Message forums across the world when he announced that Violent Videogames could legally be taxed. I remember being greatly amused and entertained by this. After all, since most Hardcore Gamers on the forums seemed to be business experts, it was now apparent that Hardcore gamers were also experts on the law as well. It was quite laughable watching all the hardcore gamers playing lawyers and issuing ‘arguments’ in their gaming message forum posts.

 

For my part in this, I reminded the Hardcore on Gamefaqs and Neogaf that most of them are not lawyers. Politicians are many things. But one things they are experts on is law. Most politicians are lawyers and all politicians deal with the law (legislators write law, justices interpret law, and executives execute the law). The only entity that gets to tell US Congress whether or not a law is legal or not is the US Supreme Court. And the US Supreme Court has said that they will not block Congress on any tax they make. People need to stop saying ‘Video games were ruled as speech. Congress can’t tax speech.’ It most certainly can. Porn is not prohibited and is defended as ‘free speech’. Yet, porn is taxed more.

 

 

What amused me is that these Hardcore refused to connect these dots with their own relationship to society. Taxing violent video games is a politically safe move because the people who play violent video games is a very small minority of the voting populationIn fact, video game playing is a minority of the voting population as well. The more people that play games, the harder it would be for any game product to be specifically taxed. But the hardcore are so stupid, they viciously attacked any ‘expanding the gaming market’ move such as the Wii, which would make it much harder to tax video games. Why aren’t violent movies and books taxed? It is because everyone consumes or has consumed a violent movie or violent book. But very, very few voting age people have consumed a violent video game. It is not politically viable to specifically tax violent books or violent movies. It IS politically viable for cash-strapped governments to tax violent video games.

 

And so here we are. Just as our more hardcore friends did not understand the constitution, they often do not understand political trends, as it is hard to interpret the direction of the law when you spend all of your time consuming videogames and reading gaming message forums. The legal trend is for State Law to precede National Policy. States were finding solutions to Healthcare long before Obama’s Health Care law took effect. Smoking was discouraged at the state level long before the national government got in the game. And demands for minimum wage increases are always answered at the state level before a notional increase. It is the same with Tax and revenues. Oftentimes it is the states that find innovative taxation policies in order to fund their governments, which then later become national policy.  

 

Do all state trends become law? No. Most do not. But the fact that this law will likely pass in my home state, and is on the docket in many others suggests that it is a possibility that this may someday become a national law. If this occurs, then the Obamacare case establishes the precedent that Congress can essentially ‘tax’ whatever the hell it wants. The justices have even said they’re not going to go through thousands of pages of a bill to find out what is fair and what isn’t fair in the pieces and parts of it. A vidoegame tax would not be challenged as The Sitting Supreme Court says that NO TAX will be challenged.  

 

I confess that a Tax that targets Gratuitously violent games has some appeal in my mind, since most of these are played by hardcore gamers that are similar in this manner to snuff film enthusiasts; In that they seem to enjoy what normal society flees from.  One could argue that hardcore gamer practices vice just as those who engage too much in alcohol and Strip Clubs. A compelling interest argument could be made that hardcore gaming is a pox on society which should be discouraged for greater good. If such an argument was made they would get no objection from me.

 

Hell it might help gaming finally become more mainstream. In this cash-strapped economy, high-taxation can and does kill products by pushing them JUST out of range. Perhaps then we would see game developers of violent games stop being such freaks and make a product that is more acceptable to society. Then we may finally see some substance over style in this industry… 

 

Exploring the New World on Nintendo Switch. Currently Playing: Zelda BOTW, Octopath Traveler, Sonic Mania, Yoku's Island Express, Mega Man 11. Currently Watching: Marble Hornets, Luther, Black Mirror, JoJo's Bizarre Adventure Part 5. Currently Reading: Influence by Robert Cialdini.

January 2, 2014
12:34 pm
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John Legendoffzelda

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I don’t see any downside to this at all; this is a great idea. You’ve made every point that I would make about this issue. Why shouldn’t these games be taxed?

I do have one question: do “violent video games” mean Mature-rated titles, or is that broadened to include some Teen ones?

January 2, 2014
12:37 pm
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Mongunzoo
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I have not read the proposal, but a friend in the state legislature speaks as if it will target Mature-rated games specifically.

Exploring the New World on Nintendo Switch. Currently Playing: Zelda BOTW, Octopath Traveler, Sonic Mania, Yoku's Island Express, Mega Man 11. Currently Watching: Marble Hornets, Luther, Black Mirror, JoJo's Bizarre Adventure Part 5. Currently Reading: Influence by Robert Cialdini.

January 2, 2014
5:55 pm
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I’m not sure so sure that this is a cash grab Mong.  

 

Some back of the envelope math (at the US Federal level):

  • Let’s assume the total number of games sold annually is 200 million
  • Let’s assume 10% of those are M-rated.  Therefore 20 million M-rated games are sold.
  • Let’s assume that a flat tax of $5 is added to the sale of M-rated games (likely an aggressive assumption)
  • Therefore a $5 tax on all M-rated games would bring in a grand total of $100 million in revenue.  This is peanuts at the Federal level.

 

This feels like less of a cash grab and more like a response to concerns over high-profile gun crimes (without upsetting the very powerful and politically influential gun lobby).

 

As an aside, you lost me with your analogy comparing hardcore M-rated title gamers to snuff film viewers.  It’s frankly a bit of a stretch.  You yourself play M-rated titles (two of your “now playing” games are M-rated).  I’m going to go and ahead and assume (hope?) that you find the idea of snuff films disgusting and repugnant, as would the overwhelming majority of M-rated game players.  M-rated games are legal, while snuff films are not, so it’s not really fair to compare M-rated game players to criminals.  Your comparison to alcohol consumers and strip club patrons feels more apt.

Now playing: SNES - Phalanx, R-Type III, Genesis - Bio Hazard Battle, PS3 - Dragon's Crown

January 2, 2014
6:20 pm
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Mongunzoo
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From what I am hearing it will be a sales tax increase akin to tobacco products. And the point is not so much as to why the federal government is doing this, but to hammer home the fact that they can since last year I was told by hysterical Hardcore gamers that this is impossible. Lo and behold here we are lol! also worth noting that while a small percentage of gaming is mature, most of the industries big AAA blockbusters are rated mature.

 

Perhaps I used the wrong term? What types of movies are you talking about here? I was referring to the budget gutter-trash goretortureporn like hostel or other such movies which will never be mainstream because normal people flee from them. The same effect can be had with much that I have seen in the current game industry.

 

That said, you bring up an important point that there is much disparity in Mature ratings, as some are tastefully done (Dark souls has almost no gratuitous violence, just dark fantasy) while others are disgusting. it ias all about how you display it. Sad that they will take it on the chin as a result…Though they can always just…you know, tone it down a little further in order to make the grade.

 

It is like saying in Final Fantasy 6 that the world implodes and most of the people of the world die. You don’t really sense it in the game because of the sprites. Shadowgate for the NES had tons of gore. Yet, despite Nintendo really policing their games hard, they left Shadowgate alone. Why? The game uses imagination more than effects. In Civilization, you are nuking cities and starving people. You commit genocide. It sounds worse than what the game actually is.

when you have graphics like this and you use it to SHOW these repugnant things, it makes a difference, and puts gaming in the crosshairs. My point is that we do not have the clout to stop it.

Exploring the New World on Nintendo Switch. Currently Playing: Zelda BOTW, Octopath Traveler, Sonic Mania, Yoku's Island Express, Mega Man 11. Currently Watching: Marble Hornets, Luther, Black Mirror, JoJo's Bizarre Adventure Part 5. Currently Reading: Influence by Robert Cialdini.

January 2, 2014
6:48 pm
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RushDawg

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Mongunzoo said
From what I am hearing it will be a sales tax increase akin to tobacco products. And the point is not so much as to why the federal government is doing this, but to hammer home the fact that they can since last year I was told by hysterical Hardcore gamers that this is impossible. Lo and behold here we are lol! also worth noting that while a small percentage of gaming is mature, most of the industries big AAA blockbusters are rated mature.

 

Perhaps I used the wrong term? What types of movies are you talking about here? I was referring to the budget gutter-trash goretortureporn like hostel or other such movies which will never be mainstream because normal people flee from them. The same effect can be had with much that I have seen in the current game industry.

 

That said, you bring up an important point that there is much disparity in Mature ratings, as some are tastefully done (Dark souls has almost no gratuitous violence, just dark fantasy) while others are disgusting. it ias all about how you display it. Sad that they will take it on the chin as a result…Though they can always just…you know, tone it down a little further in order to make the grade.

 

It is like saying in Final Fantasy 6 that the world implodes and most of the people of the world die. You don’t really sense it in the game because of the sprites. Shadowgate for the NES had tons of gore. Yet, despite Nintendo really policing their games hard, they left Shadowgate alone. Why? The game uses imagination more than effects. In Civilization, you are nuking cities and starving people. You commit genocide. It sounds worse than what the game actually is.

when you have graphics like this and you use it to SHOW these repugnant things, it makes a difference, and puts gaming in the crosshairs. My point is that we do not have the clout to stop it.

Ah, okay, I see where you are coming from now.  That’s a more fair analogy.  See the Nicholas Cage movie 8mm (or its summary) for another description of what a snuff film can be.  I don’t really want to discuss it too much further, since it doesn’t seem like appropriate conversation for SNES Hub (or anywhere really).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/8mm_(film)

 

I wouldn’t worry too much about folks who say the government “can’t” tax violent video games.  Of all the laws governments have passed throughout history, taxing violent video games is about a 1 out of 10 as far as outrageousness goes.

 

Lastly, you are right about there being a huge disparity in the amount of violence and gore in M-rated titles.  Demon’s and Dark Souls are certainly violent, but they’re not over the top or gratuitous.  The God of War games on the other hand glorify extreme acts of violence, which is very off putting.  I actually enjoy the gameplay of the GoW games, though I enjoy them in spite of the over the top violence, not because of it.  The Devil May Cry games are very similar to the GoW games (and are also M-rated), yet they’re able to be fun and edgy without being an over the top gore fest.

Now playing: SNES - Phalanx, R-Type III, Genesis - Bio Hazard Battle, PS3 - Dragon's Crown

January 2, 2014
6:55 pm
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Mongunzoo
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Jesus……..Sick world we’re living in, man…………

 

 

Exploring the New World on Nintendo Switch. Currently Playing: Zelda BOTW, Octopath Traveler, Sonic Mania, Yoku's Island Express, Mega Man 11. Currently Watching: Marble Hornets, Luther, Black Mirror, JoJo's Bizarre Adventure Part 5. Currently Reading: Influence by Robert Cialdini.

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